Nex user - some problems and questions

Begonnen von Nicolas58, Januar 14, 2018, 16:23:53

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Cypheros

We fixed processing speed bug for the next release.

The sample has is OK and should work. It seams to be a problem with the Xeobox. This box is unknown here in Germany and I don't know the chipset and technical features. Some receivers have additional files beside the main .ts file. This files have an index of iframes or other details to make navigation work.
This index files have the same file name but another extension, like .dvr or .ts.sc or .ts.ap or something like that.

Also there are often two types of mediaplayers available. One to playback the own recordings and an additional general mediaplayer to playback external files.

Nicolas58

Hello,

Sorry for my long absence, I didn't have time to make more tests.
I have purchased my licence a few days ago because my trying period was finished. So I hope we will find a solution...
Actually your software is the only simple solution I found and I think it is great, I think there is only a little problem to find and solve (maybe a bug, or maybe something I didn't configure as needed).

You're right when you say that my Xeobox has additional files (.idx and .rap). I can send you a sample if you want.
This is some points I noticed :
- original recordings are split into 4Go files, named .ts, .ts1, .ts2...
- if I remove .idx and .rap files, the recording is still readable but navigation works only on the first part, corresponding to the first ts file. The total time is the real total recorded time, and the player is able to go to the second file (.ts1) during reading or fast reading, but navigation (jumps with arrows on the time line) and displayed actual time stops at the end of the first ts file.

So OK these points could make me think you're right when you say it is a problem related to the Xeobox.
But the next points let me think there is something else :
- some of my recordings cut with TS Doctor works almost perfectly : navigation is ok on the whole recording, but the total displayed time is the total time of the original video !
- on the sample that I sent to you, navigation stops at about 10 minutes from the beginning, so it has nothing to see with the end of the first file of the original recording.
- this same sample has also navigation problems with my Samsung TV, at about 9 minutes from the beginning.

About the two types of mediaplayers often included in recorders :
In my case there are two ways to access medias :
- configure a directory which can be local (USB drive) or a network directory path (my NAS in my case). This place is used to store recordings, but it can have subdirectories and it allows to read every type of files supported by the player (several formats for videos, images and sounds). TS files are considered as recordings by the player (these files appear in the "recording list") and other formats are considered as imported files (these files appear in the "imported files list").
- use a DLNA server

I tried to convert some recordings into .mkv files with TS Doctor, so they are considered as imported files by the Xeobox : for some reason that I don't understand, the Xeobox is unable to get sound from these files. However it is able to get sound from some other .mkv files which are not created from TV recordings.

I tried to use the DLNA server of my NAS (Synology) : it is the only way that my Samsung TV uses. On some recordings the Samsung TV has navigation problems. I didn't see navigation problems with the Xeobox when using the DLNA server, but I have no sound on it (maybe the same problem as for .mkv files ???).

So as you can see, I despair of finding a simple solution always working... I think the simplest solution would be to make my recordings work on the Xeobox (it doesn't matter the Samsung TV doesn't read it), as I have a Xeobox at the 2 places where I want to read my recordings.

I am convinced that some erroneous time information remains in the files generated by TS Doctor, otherwise how could the reader display the total time of the original video in place of the total time after cutting ?
I made a new try yesterday, on this recording the total recorded time was 3 hours. After cutting I have 1 hour and 53 minutes of video. I asked TS Doctor to save the result into a completely new file name, and after that the Xeobox is always saying that the total time of the video is 3 hours !!! In this case the navigation works, it's only the total time that is false, but the Xeobox has not any possibility to know where does this new file come from. So the total time of 3 hours is inevitably written into it !

Maybe it has something to see with the Fortis IRTA packet ? It says this packet is detected and I asked to keep it... I'll make a try without keeping it.
Another idea : maybe the index file is the same as the one you can create with your tool "TS index creator" ? Should I try it and rename the resulting files into .rap and . idx ?

Maybe you could examine my .idx and my .rap files ?

There is a technical description of my Xeobox at this url : https://www.aervi.fr/Download/PDF/XEOFIX/hd_t_7810.pdf
The Xeofix company no longer exists, I bought my devices several years ago. Apart from the fact I cannot cut my recordings with it, I'm very satisfied of its quality for TV recording and playing. I is not adapted for playing any media formats, but it doesn't matter for me.

Thank you for your help...

Mam

a very simple, but very powerful too, solution is to use a "real" Mediaplayer.
Those included in your Samsung TV and other devices are crippled to the bones. They only play those formats that is usually used in the shop of that company. Pure shit!

Get a simple PI (3), throw Libreelec onto its SD card, connect it to LAN and TV (with HDMI) and fire it up!

It plays almost everything that is currently available (no UHD / H265 stuff yet!), and it silently converts those input files to an output format, your TV Set does not start to choke on!

You can get all needed parts for ~50€ (a little bit more if you want a fancy housing too), there are also vendors which offer them "ready built" (but beware, some of them include "doubtful" addons which are not supported by the main creators, better play it safe and use only the free downloadable stuff from the original distribution websites).

(its so easy to be used, even wifes can be trained to use them alone and without too many or too loud complains! *)

(*) may take some time for training  ;D

Nicolas58

Thank you for your answer Mam. I already thought about this solution as a "last chance solution". It is not my preferred solution because I don't want to multiply the number of devices and remote controls (libreElec requires a smartphone or a keyboard and/or a mouse, it is another type of remote control...). As you say, only one device is also only one way to learn for my wife and my children, who often schedule recordings themselves and watch them directly on the Xeobox without having it cut by TS Doctor (I will cut only good films that I want to keep...).

I agree with you, I am tired of all these commercial devices (TV's, media players and recording boxes) that often do only half of what they promise, and what they promise is already half of what should be possible... Of course I'm not talking about your PI based solution as it is open source.
But using the same device for recording and reading should not be mission impossible... I'm always hoping for a solution. If one day we have a Raspberry Pi with a DVB-T card, surely I'll be very interested in it.
Today I have my 2 Xeobox devices and I'd like to use them at their potential...

And with this great software - TS Doctor, I have almost a perfect solution to use ONLY my Xeobox devices.
So if the author of this software is able to and has the kindness to help me make it work, I prefer this solution very much.
Maybe we will find why the total time of the original recording remains in the cut file, and maybe he will correct some bug at this occasion, it would be a win for everyone !

Note that the readers of my TV's are not so bad : today I finally found a way to jump through the breaking point on my Samsung TV (there are 2 navigation bars, the first one is displayed when I directly use right and left buttons and this one doesn't jump through the breaking point, but there is another one accessible into some menu, and this one works).
And  my other TV is an old Sony KDL 32CX520, its network functions are limited so I had disconnected it from the network a long time ago, but I finally reconnected it today and it reads my cut recordings like a charm ! The only issue with the Sony TV is that I didn't find how to choose the language. But It seems to choose the correct one (French) on all videos, whereas I have to change it on the Samsung TV.

So I have found a work around, but if Cypheros agrees to work on the problem it would help my wife and my children, used to the Xeobox menus, and I would be very grateful...

Cypheros

The indexer for Enigma ist only possible because Enigma is "Open Source" and you can look into the source code to see how the indexing is done.

I can't find Xeofix source code or any documentation explaining the format of the index files.

Mam

aah, I see, you did not really understand my strategy behind my suggestion (PI & Co), so lemme try it again:

* Many Vendors use "special" Formats that are not documented anywhere like your Xeofix for example. Even between different machines from the same company, format changes are not uncommon. Many (most) companies block requests for documentation, if a company is already out of business, its unlikely that you ever manage to find somebody who can tell.
* of course, its normal, that you can play back a recording on the same device where you have done the recording (at least, this SHOULD be very very normal)
* if you edit the recordings with external tools like the TSDoc it is also common that afterwards some special informations that are needed by that particular device are missing, the resulting file wont play there anymore.

This happens almost EVERYWHERE and ANYTIME.

You can either overcome this by making the tools more clever and producing more specialized output files for each possible device (as one can easily see, this is a job for somebody that wants to spend his lifetime on chasing new specials that come out each day and anywhere in the world),
OR you switch your workflow to a more submissing, but always working, way: use the tools to convert the files into a common and widespread format that can be played EVERYWHERE.

As you can guess, the last part is my way to go.

I take recordings from any device I have (and I do have some different, you can bet), the TSDoc can read them, so I use him for cutting/cleaning.
The output file is then put into an ecoding tool (I use "Handbrake", others prefer VideoReDo or so) that recreates the whole file, changing video AND audio formats.
My standard output format is currently 720p25 with AAC2.0 sound (or Dolby Digital 5.1 if the source is multichannel) plus subtitles, and all my players (if PIs, or PCs, or even builtin Players in TVs) are capable of playing back THIS format. (the H264 video settings are rather "simple", so even small devices can handle them without stress).
These settings are stored as "Presets" into "Handbrake", so I dont need to pick anything for the next file to do...

I can just drop these (final) output files into my central film store in my LAN and dont have to worry where, if and by what it can be played.

Therefor I dont need to chase "special" things of some devices, I can even change the recording device as long, as the new one's format can be read by the TSDoc, without affecting anything in my workflow.

And for the "wife's training" its also nice to present them the same user interface at the players everywhere. So here on my PIs, Fire-TVs, Smart-TVs or PCs, they will always find the same Version of KODI, with the same settings everywhere (and using a central database too). All players look the same and show the same menus and files. I just copy a new film in and use a tool called "Ember" to rename it correctly and add the infos/pictures from the internet. All players do present these infos and allow them to be searched (wife's training #234: "how to find a certain movie among the many thousands that are stored").

Anyway, all this needs some disciplin and careful planning ahead...  ;D

(and of course, your demands may be totally different, so just take this as an example of a working workflow and create your own)

Nicolas58

Ok Mam, I understand your point of view, and your strategy is obviously a good strategy given that you have numerous recorders and the possibility to put Kodi on all your readers.
At this time my goal is to be able to read my recordings with the devices I already have, and to keep them in a standard format with the least amount of re-encoding possible (re-encoding is always a loss of quality and needs more processing time...).

Before this conversation I didn't know that almost all recorders were adding their own information in their own format. For free DVB I thought stupidly that they wrote the whole DVB stream without changing anything, except those which encrypt the stream (in France, some internet providers do that with their box...).

In the case of my Xeobox, it remains true that it is generally able to read the stream after cutting the file with TS Doctor, so without the additional .rap and .idx files. On original recordings it seems that the .idx file is necessary to go from .ts to .ts1 file (but with TS Doctor I merge them into one file), and removing the .rap file seems not to be a problem. The issue of the breaking point for navigation is only on some recordings, and all cut recordings have a false total time information after cutting. And this false time information is necessarily written in the .ts file.
I firstly thought that this bad time information was in a standard format, but now if Cypheros is sure of its PCR time correction (sorry if it is not the good name, I saw it into the options...), I understand it could eventually be in a special substream of the file and in a special format. And I'm not sure that this false total time is the origin of the issue.

Cypheros, of course I understand you can refuse to spend time examining some files which are not standard.
I'm a software developer in a totally different field, so I don't know much about video streams (but I know how long can be the research of an issue...), and I'm simply wondering if you could eventually demux the streams and try to find where this bad time information is hiding. TS Doctor's demuxer finds only video, audio and subtitles streams, maybe something else is hiding in the whole file ?
Fortis FTRI packets are present in the file and if I do not ask to keep them the file is not readable by the Xeobox. I don't know what are these Fortis packets, but something tells me that the Xeobox is a derivative of a family of products ("Fortis family") that you know and you have added special processing for them.
So maybe you could discover something new about this family of products ?

Again, if you refuse I can understand. Your software remains a very good software and I'm satisfied of it !

I have other minor issues related to TS Doctor, I will post it in another topic if I have time for that.


www.cypheros.de